Posted by Bastosa on Monday, October 20th, 2008 - 32 Comments
Tags: 3.0.2, heroics, Karazhan, nerf, raiding, wrath of the lych king
Now that the new patch is alive and kicking, my guild has decided to get back to raiding. Finally! This is great news, but things seem, well, different. I know Blizzard went ahead and reduced mob’s health by 30% for the new patch, and I also know that all of the classes have been buffed a bit with their new abilities. What I wasn’t quite ready for was the net result of all of this. All of the raid content is now ridiculously easy. This has been an extreme nerf, way more so than I had expected. Perhaps it was just the new class abilities are just much more powerful than it seems, or maybe 30% is just way more than I was able to visualize. Either way, wow.
In the last two days alone we have had groups go through Kara in half (literally) the time it used to take, we have earned a few guild firsts, and we have taken groups of people who have never raided before into 25-mans with ease. It’s all quite overwhelming.
Even heroics have changed significantly. About two pulls into my first heroic since the patch (Ramps), my group quickly went from strategic marking and pulling to just grabbing 14 mobs at a time and AOEing everything down. CC has been rendered completely useless.
These made many of us reconsider our activities for the next few weeks. We now have the opportunity to see content that we never thought we would be able to see. Of course we will go down those bosses that always gave us trouble (Vashj I’m looking at you), but after that I think we will be able to press on into content we have never even seen. I even heard about a trade channel PUG that cleared most of Black Temple, surely we can do the same!
As fun as this is, I can’t help but think this massively devalues these encounters. Sure we may get guild firsts, but do they count? No way. I no longer get a since of pride from downing a boss, it’s just an achievement/gear run for me now. It’s kind of sad. But then again, I don’t think anyone is really kidding themselves.
All in all I think I am just going to take it as it is. I will enjoy the easy achievements, see some new things, gear up my alt, and continue to wait for new (non-nerfed) content in Wrath!
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By mikesmit on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 10:13 am
aye, the raids have been extremely nefed and all classes extremely buffed, but a BT cleared PuG? wow! get’s me thinking if I should make 1
greetz,
Mikesmit (EU Aszune)
By ThoMage on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 10:19 am
i agree… me and my guild havent beatin Supremus just yet, but saturday night we ran all the way and downed mister Illidan… first on every boss after Sup… in one night!
we’re starting SWP tomorrow and will seriously go all of the way i think… our tanks and healers have taken an extreme advance of 3.0.2 and we kill SSC like it were Kara on a lazy night oO
By Cloudbearer on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 10:30 am
This was kind of a disappointing change. My guild was on illidan and archi attempts before this change went in, but we ended up downing them both in one night.
I understood that a lot of these changes were due to raid and class mechanic changes, but it’s pretty absurd how easy the content is now. Oh well, we’re still going to take advantage of it.
By Enteri on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 10:34 am
I pugged Kara on my new alt and we easily downed Prince.
Did you all know they are buffing paladins again next patch.
It’s kind of like what they did with druids when they where op. They just kept buffing them.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=21886.0
Also check out the rogues. How does three ambushes in a row sound… Are you kidding me.
By Dave Pallister on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 10:41 am
hi i am a paladin tank and i have to say i agree with u i did the black temple and thort it easy and kara 2 and today when thorw zul’man like it was nothink but im taking advantage of it so i can gear up of wraith
By Beartrucci on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 11:00 am
I am loving the recent nerf of the instances. Cleared kara out in no time at all and I even brought my recently ding’d level 70 hunter to another kara and got some decent gear.
Also been in a Black Temple PuG and downed the first two bosses and got to start of the 3rd before everyone left. This new nerf to the instances is like a complete breath of fresh air to WoW for me, seems like a different game being able to experience all the content I never thought I would.
By Will on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 11:02 am
See, this doesn’t really disappoint me so much as make me really, REALLY interested in the raid content of LK. Imagine what they’re going to send at us to counter the over-powered people.
By Dunnion on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 11:16 am
I think its good for people like me, who were only able to raid Kara, and the first couple of ZA bosses, due to timing conflicts and not being able to raid with a 25 man group.
Do I think it makes the achievement less? of course! But that doesn’t mean that I don’t want to see all the fights that I can.
Before the patch I made a point to do a 40 man nax run before it was changed forever, and even at 70 some of the boss fights were hard (that being said, the boss fights that I did at 60 that seemed impossible were laughable).
I would love to see all of ZA, SSC, and TK, I doubt I’ll be able to see BT or Hyjal.
By Spencer on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 11:48 am
Yes. I was part of the excutus /2 pug that cleared BT and got an offhand glaive. You have to be elitest with the pug and know the pulls and boss fights. It’s not an everyday run of the mill pug.
By Nylow on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 12:49 pm
As u said, we kinda knew what was being changed, but didn’t really think of what it would do in the game itself.
My guild (small) has been able to join up with a couple other guilds and friends list and all weekend we were getting gear for peeps. Gruul’s & Mag were toast. Missed the BT run, but I hear it went well. For fun we went into SP (reg) for a newly 70 alt with greens. No healer and 4 manned the place!! Shocked, but achievement done.
I am not sure about the 30% less health, but I try to look at it as we have access to lvl 80 abilities and with how peeps were able to prepare and gear up things do seem extremely easy. Hell we did H Slabs in an hour (that thing was a pain in Reg mode).
Ah, well, nice to see stuff that was taking forever to get into and will do as much as I can before they adjust things for WotLK.
Here’s to farming HH for the mount and to the new stuff we are able to do. Thx Bliz!!
By Pauldy on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
I think it is a good thing because it gives people who have a life outside of the game a chance to experience some of these high level raids and have them be fun. Instead of having them be a grinding ass whopping that makes you wonder if this is really just a second job.
The runs I have been on after the patch are more fun in my opinion. But I’m the type who just plays for fun not to prop up the inadequacies in my personal life through the accomplishments of my online avatar so to each his own.
By Urza on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
My theory is Blizzard thinks people are going to stop playing even MORE of the old raids and dungeons so they made them easier for smaller (or less optimized) groups to get through.
By Alayea on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
Just because Blizzard nerfed the mobs’ health by 30% doesn’t automatically make the instances a free ride. Yourself and the other group members have to know what to do in a particular instance (and actually go through with it), and having at least blue eq is a given.
I’m just saying… >_>
By nordahl on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 1:52 pm
hehe i know all about it i went with a pug and we downed illidan.. yes a pug did illidan .. and it wasnt to hard either.. 2 wipes and he was down
By Toomsie on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
I totally agree with everything you wrote.
Sure, Blizzard nerfed raiding. And yes, people are whining.. but who cares! I love raiding.. I love that I can finally see some new content.
I just want to say to everyone out there who is whining about Blizzard nerfing everything - If you don’t like it you don’t have to play. Whine threads surely isn’t going to change Blizzard’s mind. So you can either live with it and think of the positive stuff or just quit playing lol.
Oh, and I love you guys. Not in a g*y way though.
By David Fisher on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 2:48 pm
I think it’s pretty obvious that they want people to get to Lvl 70 and experience some of this content so they will want to move on to WotLK when it comes out. Blizzard has been handing out XP like it’s candy on Halloween.
It does them no good for the update if only a small portion of the people are of a level that they can take advantage of WotLK. I think they learned a lot from the launch of BC.
As a casual player however I’m fine with it. The game isn’t too easy ever and there is still challenge. There is ALWAYS something harder you could do if you need to kick it up a notch. I like being able to feel powerful for once and not have to play 40 hours a week.
Casual player endorsement!
By WML on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
Agreed David Fisher. I am using this time to lvl my alts, and farm resources.
An example? A 70 Mage and Huntard, ran me and a couple other lowbies (lvl 57 Shad Preist) thru Ramps. Cleared it easily in 15 mins. I was all for the XP but also dissappointed that it was so easy.
I actually hope this Uberness is just here for the transitional period, while people are getting used to the new mechanics. I’d put money on them leveling the playing field in a month…
By Skux on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
My resto shammy alt did kara for the first time yesterday… without ANY experience of any heroics! and we cleared it lol… there were prob 3-4 first timers, including someone’s mage friend who i think just turned 70 half an hour ago LOL
yeh.. i got some pretty sweet gear lol
By thefire on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 5:51 pm
ya i am a mage who pre patch had only done kara through curator. Tried gruuls but the raid wiped at 6% on gruul. I got in a pug for gruuls and mags. Cleared everything with no wipe. I did not die once. We even decided to go up to void reaver in TK and we got him on the second try. Not as cool as the peope pugging BT, but i never in a thousand years thought i would see any T5 content.
even with all that raiding in one night, not one single drop went my way, needless to say i was pissed
By Danad on Monday, October 20th, 2008 at 11:57 pm
I went Gruul with a pug and we took all down easily… no wipes and some of the members had 400+dmg!
YAY!
By Daii on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 2:00 am
Now, i don’t agree with you at all, these are lvl 70 instances are they not? Soon the level cap will be 80 and what lvl 70 would want to spend months and months of their time to do lvl 70 instances? For gear that they will probably switch pretty soon with questgear?
Considering that there will soon be a new level cap there will obviusly be heroic lvl 80 instances to, 70 is of the past, look to the future!
And i’m not even 70 yet =_=….
For you it may “devalue” the encounter, but for someone else, a newly dinged lvl 70, that still has 10 levels to go, i think the new “nerfed” instances will make a whole lot more sense. Just be happy that you get a chance to see instaces you thought you’d never see!
By Ozzel's Cousin Fred on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 6:30 am
My guild has been stuck on some encounters for months, these changes have made it possible for us to get some progression on content we never thought we’d see, so I don’t mind. It may allow a bit of sloppiness but hey, wiggle room is something they took out of the game with TBC raid encounters anyway.
They’ll rebalance a little more closer to wrath, but I enjoy not having to be overly picky about every pull and getting groups. It feels “right”.
Besides who ever enjoyed taking 4 hours to clear Kara? It became a drag after a while. Cleared it in an hour and a half yesterday with my alt (for the first time ever). Fun times.
My guild has been saying “it’s the most fun we’ve had raiding in months”. Even when we were killing gorefiend in 2 FPS lag.
By Alkaid on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 7:02 am
That would explain how the PUG i joined was able to beat 3 of the bosses at Magisters’ Terrace (none of us had done it before and we were not even properly geared for it) unfortunately i had to go to class before we even got to Kael but i hope on getting to him over the weekend…
Although its easier it was still very fun and i had a blast; i never thought in a million years i would even get the opportunity to go to Mags or Kara. Tanks are very hard to find on my server so i’m looking forward to tanking some more end game stuff before Lich King is released.
By Insanepoet on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 7:30 am
While people who were experiencing high end raids may be utterly pissed at the thought of pugs and lesser geared players getting to the content they worked with a passion to get to; look at Onyxia, BWL, Naxx, AQ, and MC. How many people still went into this content once BC hit?
Im hoping this nerf will stay, first of all it will allow people to still go back and obtain drops (gear/profession) as well as gain raid experience learning how much fun it can be screaming at your monitor with more than 4 other people on the other side of the screen.
Personally I think that this move may keep players entering these encounters more often then the ones practically forgetten after BC’s release, let alone those of us who currently enjoy going back to MC at 70 and taking out Rag for those endless wipes he supplied us pre-bc.
By Mushy on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 8:51 am
I think that this nerf is great! Yes, things may be overpowered and easy, but I think this is maybe Blizzard’s attempt to give people who have never raided an a shot at seeing how a 25-man goes. Also give them a shot at getting good gear before the expansion hits. I hope that they do not change this. And if you think about the overpoweredness at the moment, don’t you think while leveling to 80 all of it is going to balance itself out? Yeah, it will. I love this new patch and I hope they keep it kicking until after the release.
By Blickter on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 9:59 am
Me and my buddy set up an SSC pug the other day, we ended up AoEing most of it, and we cleared everything except Vashj out (a 5 phase fight with a pug is never an easy thing). We probably would have downed her too, except our MT and a few healer simautaneously left. Also, gear checks were implemented.
On the PTR I did a geared pug that cleared BT. We had 3 healers. It is rather nice to be able to see new content. I only ever pug stuff (my time can’t be scheduled), so its nice to be able to set up geared pugs to do stuff like SSC, TK, and Hyjal. BT is a bit extreme, and I think that only the oldest realms will be doing SWP pugs. Still fun though.
By kiley on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 11:11 am
right after the nerf i joined up a hyjal summit pug and then a TK the eye pug, both of which we cleared and had a lot of fun getting great gear. Imo, blizz made a smart move with nerfing and the achievements if their intent was to get players to do all the game content and still run BC raids even once Wotlk is out. Anywho as long as we’re occupied till wotlk comes out blizz did good, oh and Sunwell plateau here we come
By Seth on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 11:46 am
raids only or dungeon too? or maybe all mobs in the outland?
By Luminaa on Tuesday, October 21st, 2008 at 7:23 pm
anyone else notice that the money from the isle dialies has been cut a bit?
kinda annoying on PvP server get ganked by OP retri pallys and Fury warriors for less money =D love it!
loving cruising Heroics with my rogue and also lvling my alt… its more fun… i can pretty easily clear ‘red’ quests in my log…
fun times definately welcomed the easier leveling it was getting a little dry but i think the speed has breathed a little life into the game…
imo its cool =) ta muchly blizz i think!!
By Vên on Wednesday, October 22nd, 2008 at 6:34 am
Yep… cleared Heroic UB today with 19 minutes left on the single elixir of agility I popped at the beginning of the raid…lol…
By FrOzEnFiRe on Monday, October 27th, 2008 at 4:39 am
ye i love the nerf.. pefore patch my guild and all PuGs stuck in ZA on jan’alain after patch..lol it was a cake with strawberrys on it. cleared whole thing with no wipes easy =p.. oh yeah..pallys do sick burst dmg..so far been either 1st or in top 5 in dps in all my raids..and still have some blues..=D ..ARCANITE REAP…’TROLLBANE ‘HOOOOO!!!!!!!!!! (got trollbane from 2nd chest, yes we succeded with timed also but im sad that thers no bear mount anymore =(. )
By Zythen on Monday, October 27th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
I accuacly liked it Let us finish BT ( we were progressing but not as fast as the expansion was aproching ) and Ive gotten to see most of sunwell now so Its nice to at least see the content before we all go to the expansion and at least for me never touch the old stuff again ( well besides go to everything once to get the achivements for my new DK that ill be replacing my prot pali with )