Posted by iTZKooPA on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 - 22 Comments
Tags: alts, angry baby, arcanums, badge gear, ebon blade, frenzyheart, gearing your alts, heirloom items, hodir, mmoc-champion, oracles, patch 3.3, ptr 3.3, reputation grinds
Yea, We Finally Broke Out The Angry Baby Picture On Project Lore
I’ll admit that farming reputation on your alts just for some added enchants - head and shoulders (knees and toes) - can be rather annoying, but it makes sense. After all, the various factions, Ebon Blade, Hodir, Oracles, etc, don’t have any idea that Solidsagart is actually Solidsamm’s long lost draenei sister (from another mother). So when I read on MMO-Champion that arcanums have become heirloom items in the latest build I balked.
Early on in the history of WoW Blizzard stated that the game begins at level 80. Since then the company has constantly reinforced this idea, speeding up leveling, introducing the Heirloom Item category, dropping mount prices, and more. Why then, did the developer decide to take out part of the end game - yes, I am referring to rep grinding as part of the end game - for our alts? Is it just because many mains have run out of things to spend their badges on?
It’s unfortunate that Blizzard is toying with the idea of removing a staple of the end game, and a damn fine way to gain a ton of gold. I concede that it’s an annoying mechanic, but it doesn’t need to be abandoned, nor should it. Just shorten the process for alts like everything else.
Here’s a solution that fits with character development, the whole idea of reputation and lowers the pain. Have the alternates introduce themselves as friends/brothers/sisters/lovers of the main character. By doing so, the secondary toons would jump to the level below the referrer (ie Exalted on your main gives you Revered on your alt). Yes, it’ll take some extra coding, likely tap in to the account bound code, but it wouldn’t upset people as much, negate previous work, but still reduce the workload of players.
To me, heirloom items are meant to be replaced when you hit level 80, not equipped as part of your raid ensemble. Of course this could mean that Blizzard is working on new head and shoulder enchants…
Am I being too particular? Is it hypocritical of me to use heirloom items to hit level 80, but to be upset with heirloom items at level 80? Do you welcome the change, should it go live, or are you disgruntled by the disruption to character progression as well?
Related Posts: Reputation, PTR 3.3: New Build (10623), Raid Testing Schedule Updated, The Bugs Of World of Warcraft, PTR 3.3: Transmute Titanium Change, Hellfire Ramparts,
By Kyle on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 12:32 pm
gotta take into account that alliance AND horde players can now be on the same realm on one account, so maybe they may need a little more work to get that plan done when your mains an ally and the alts a horde
By Kelith on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 1:08 pm
They’ve always allowed people to have both Horde and Alliance characters on PVE/RP servers up until 4-5 months ago when they allowed this on PVP servers as well. As of right now, you can’t send heirloom items from Horde to Alliance or vice versa without faction transferring but they say that they’ll probably change this in the near future.
As for the actual post, I think you’re worrying about this a little too much. For people like me who’ve got 6 80s, this really isn’t that big a deal. All it does is save time. It’s not game breaking or anything and they’re not actually changing the items just because they’re heirloom. This is just saving a lot of headache and rewarding the people who have already gone through all the work, the same way you can buy Cold Weather Flying at 68 using an heirloom tome. Also, this doesn’t exactly count as character progression. I can see your point but why not argue something like being able to buy t9 just from doing enough heroic dailies and never setting foot inside a raid instead of a mindless grind for reputation that you’ve done time and time again. I welcome this change. Should be nice.
By fredb257 on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 1:42 pm
srry to be this guy,
3rd
By Eventime on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 2:26 pm
The angry baby looks so much better when he has on an army helmet
By cocopuff on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 2:27 pm
kelith@ ” but why not argue something like being able to buy t9 just from doing enough heroic dailies and never setting foot inside a raid” are you serious? we are not even talking about taht why do you have to bring that into this blog? sorry if you cant except that regardless of what we say blizz will do what they THINK (emphasis on think) is best for the game.
i dont know about you guys but i had fun grinding rep but thats not say that i would wanto go back and go from square one i think they should do what they do with achievements or make tradeble between characters not jsut your own characters but other player characters
By cocopuff on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 2:28 pm
wth iTZKooPA? one of your siblings? or a random bady?
By Alayea on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 2:35 pm
I agree, iTZKooPA. Blizzard shouldn’t go live with it because while the creation of the BoA leveling stuff was a welcoming relief, making the rep. enchants themselves BoA is… well… ridiculous. Make it easier if you’re doing rep. grinding for an alt, but don’t take away a (the) main reason for doing it in the first place.
And if anyone should wonder if I know what I’m talking about, yes I do. I have 3 80s that have the Crusader title, “The Northern Vanguard” achievement, and are exalted with SoH.
By Davrin on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 3:11 pm
Perhaps the heirloom item could provide a rep boost at turn in or while wearing a faction tabard. (Similar to the Human Racial Bonus.) A 20% - 30% boost in rep gains would shorten the grind without eliminating it completely on the Alts.
By fuzzy on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 3:51 pm
@ cocopuff he was just making a point
@ Kelith i agree with both of your ideas
By xianghua on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 3:52 pm
@ Davrin
Yes, they already give us +20% xp boost for our alts with chest and shoulder BoAs, so why not do the same for rep? Seems fine to me.
By Gaudim on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 4:13 pm
The rep grind is still there for titles, simply changing enchants to heirlooms isn’t really a game changer and furthers their idea of making the game more accessibly. Raid encounters are tuned with the top tier of loot in mind. This includes faction enchants which give excellent bonuses. Really, no one will be allowed to join a raid without their exalted Hodir, Argent Crusade, Ebon Blade, etc enchants. Which means, if they want to make raids more accessible, they need to make it easier for you to bring a newer character to a raid. Faster leveling did that. Token increases are doing that. And now BoA arcanums are doing that.
In 2.0 if someone in your guild rerolled a second character to fill a raid requirement you have to get them to 70, grind rep, rerun old raids all to get them to the point that they could join your current raid schedule.
By reducing/removing key requirements (I’m looking at you Vials of Eternity) raiders could roll alts and fill gaps caused by churn/guild drama. Additionally newbie raiders were able to fill newly vacant spots in raiding guilds as well without the guild having to invest a ridiculous amount of time to bring them up to speed.
Rep grinds aren’t even close to being removed. Titles and achievements still maintain the glamor of having done the same set of quest for days/weeks/months. So it’s not like you’ll still only have incentive to get more than one character to exalted with a faction. It just removes the requirement and allows people to enter raids easier, making it more accessible. They don’t want another Naxx 1.0 ever again.
By Fabrizi on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 4:22 pm
i have to say it seems more of a “get ur shiny, new 80 into raids quicker” thing rather than an “no more rep dailies” thing.
By Kyle on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 4:41 pm
fabrizi is right, thats exactly what it is
By Laeltis on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 5:20 pm
From what I understand. It’s not going to be BoA. It’s going to be BoA until equiped/used etc.
So it’s not exactly a BoA item. It’s pretty much a “I’m going to buy this for a friend, mkay?” Type of deal.
By Zero on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 6:25 pm
@cocopuff blizz will never do what they “think” is right for the game, they will do whatever they “think” will make them more money.
They should just get it over with and make it so that when you hit 80 all your alts start at 80 with comparable gear instead of slowly adding all this crap that just wastes players time and money.
By Pegraath on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 6:28 pm
The tome of Cold Weather Flying is BoA and gets used up when you send it to your level 68 alt who’s just pulled in to Borean Tundra and is several hours levelling or a warlock/mage away from Dalaran. It’s a convenience that saves minutes rather than a lot of time (though reducing the level requirements for flight probably saved 15 or so hours of hard land based levelling)
By Displace on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 7:43 pm
@Zero
I have to disagree with you. Although Blizz does need money to stay alive as a company, it comes as second nature to them. They have done great sucess on only a few titles, because their primary goal is to make a quality game that people enjoy.
If they were just in it to make money then WOW would have been dead long ago. This isn’t to say they are always right in their assumptions, but they already know that it is impossible to please everyone. So yes, they do what they think is right for the game, while taking into consideration their player base.
By aadjed on Thursday, October 22nd, 2009 at 11:14 pm
Why not add tabards for SoH, Ebonblade, Oracles / Frenzyheart? And why only Northrend factions? How about those endless grinds for TBC reps? And while they are at it, why not give everyone the ambassador title as soon as they leave the starting area at lvl10? I have only been playing for about 1.5 yrs, but everything blizz has done since wotlk to make the game more accesible has removed a big element of satisfaction from the game. I am a casual player, but i got a mage to lvl69 in only 6 days of playing time. It took me about 20 days of playing time to get my drood to lvl80.
By Alayea on Friday, October 23rd, 2009 at 12:08 am
@aadjed
There’s a tabard for the Ebon Blade already.
By Uthers on Friday, October 23rd, 2009 at 2:15 am
Let’s forget about the people who have had that level capped character for a while and are starting their next. Not for long, but just a second here. There are (as of current) three sets of rep groups. Vanilla (Including racial factions), Burning Crusade, and Lich King. There is purportedly one more faction coming to Lich King. A person starting the game today would grind through roughly 60 levels of not gaining rep (mostly with lesser factions. Hydraxian Waterlords, anyone?) some of which are in very limitted areas (Waterlords, Thorium Brotherhood) and who cares what they give anymore since the level 80 stuff is better?
Next is Outland and ten levels of maybe getting one exalted (don’t know what level you can start the Shatarii Skyguard grind at now that flying’s lower level), probably Honor Hold/Thrallmar, or maybe even sporegar if you’re dedicated enough. This is probably where you’ll hit exalted with your racial faction, maybe one or two allied (Draenei and Blood Elves especially). Meanwhile, try getting a group to run Kara for the Violet Eye rep sometime now that Argent Crusade’s the big deal.
Then there’s Northrend. The rep here is easier to get than most (Got a favorite level 80 heroic? Grabba tabbard and run!) with a few that are somewhat harder, but offering no real tangible reward other than another exalted. And as long as you’re in Storm Peaks, may as well hit the Sons of Hodir dailies, but if you’re doing more in Scholozar Basin, the trip over can seem more the hassle than not.
So now you’re level 80, you’ve got a few exalted reps, but if you really want the Bloodsail, Wintersaber Trainers, or whatever, it means running back to an area you’re way too high level to be challenged by and generally performing tedious tasks for a few rep points. Or worse, gathering cloth so you can switch from Booty Bay to Bloodsail or vice versa, also garnering a few rep points at a time. It’s not the end-game rep that needs tweaking (aside maybe from linking like reps somehow. Say, exalted with Ebon Blade granting a bonus in rep gained for Ashen Verdict or somesuch)
That being said, what happens when Cataclysm hits? Do the Waterlords suddenly become desirable to have rep with? Do we have an entirely new set of factions to gain popularity over (other than the obvious two, Worgen and Horde-Goblin)? Do some factions just disappear, and if so what happens to their rep points?
This is all part of what Blizz is thinking about when they make the rep changes. It’s not about handing out titles, and it’s not just about getting that sweet end-game gear spread out among alts (not that they don’t factor in). It’s also about the inconvenience (grind/time/hassle/difficulty) versus rewards (titles/gear/extra content/sense of having done it just because)
Incidentally, I’m a ‘does it just because’. I might never use it, but I WILL have that Waterlord exalted someday….
By Kagitaar on Sunday, October 25th, 2009 at 2:23 am
As others have mentioned, the chants will be an heirloom in the same way Cold Weather Flying tome is an heirloom; all it means is that if someone else on your account has done the work already you don’t have to do the same for every character you get to 80. It’s the same item, just will added functionality. I’ve done the Sons rep twice now and am planning on leveling 3 more characters to 80, I relish this decision. I will not be forced to do the same rep grind over and over (even though they have made it easier) just to be able to take them on an alt run (and contribute to the best of my abilities) of whatever raid my guild wants to do. The rep is there if you want to do it again, no one is stopping you, its just not a block for late leveling.
By Versatu on Tuesday, October 27th, 2009 at 11:44 am
I mostly agree with the concept of easing a bit, BUT only to a point. For example all TBC reps could use a boost for your alts while grinding rep. I like the idea of introducing ourselves to a faction as being “related” to our main toon. Maybe start off as “Honored” but get diminished returns on rep turn ins OR the other way around; start off like all others but because of our exalted kin, the alt(s) would get increased rep gains. Personally I like the second option, much like the RAF & Heirloom xp boost.
Just my 2 cents worth. And yes I have been there, done that on my main